My dog loves to fetch, but he's got this need to "kill" what he fetches, which means he shakes it, hard, from side to side. I was thinking we were in for $15 a month or more to keep him in frisbees until I found the Zisc--we've been on the same one for almost half a year! He ripped it right away, of course, but I figured out that I could cut out the thinner, rippable center of the frisbee and leave the thicker rim and that's what's working for us. It doesn't fly as well as it does when it has the center, but it flies pretty good and it still floats. When he carries it, it flips over his ears and gets stuck there, between his mouth and the back of his head, but he's learned how to paw it off when he gets back to me. I'm thinking that making a ring with a wider thick edge and less open area in the middle might be just the ticket for the super-destructible dogs like mine...